Civilization began when we stopped being hunter gatherers and started being sedentary with agriculture. Those structures you’re referring to were being built thousands of years after civilization began. One could argue it goes even deeper; when we stopped being immediate-return hunter gatherers and switched to delayed-return hunter gatherers, then the concept of elites began, which is the root of individualism, the cancer that led to the beginning of civilization.
Your pizza story is irrelevant because in my worldview things like money and material wealth and items that are not collectively owned and shared would not exist; now there would be personal possessions to help in tasks like hunting or maybe ornamentation, but anything that is for the good of the group would be shared. In traditional hunter-gatherer societies, rather than relying on a moneyed economy or barter economy, they usually had what is called a gift economy. In this, your relationship with others is one of the most important things, and contributes to the cohesion of the group. It builds trust. One of the ways to do this is to always give each other gifts.
Civilization began when we stopped being hunter gatherers and started being sedentary with agriculture. Those structures you’re referring to were being built thousands of years after civilization began.
IIUC, civilization started with cities, or at least towns; just as history began with writing.
One could argue it goes even deeper; when we stopped being immediate-return hunter gatherers and switched to delayed-return hunter gatherers, then the concept of elites began, which is the root of individualism, the cancer that led to the beginning of civilization.
I tend to think there was some overlap. e.g. there were/still are indigenous in the Amazon who while still hunting and gathering, also engage in agriculture, including slash-and-burn; meanwhile, many farmers also hunted; and let’s not forget herders. Wealth wasn’t only land one held, but also how much livestock one owned.
Elites probably resulted with larger groups, which might have been the result of technological advances, such as more farming, as well as specialization of labor. There was also gender-specific roles. Generally it was the men who hunted, while the women gathered, maybe butcher the carcasses, and made winter clothes, while rearing the children they bore.
Perhaps sometimes a band would raid other bands, then later simplify it to extortion. Consensus gave way to either majority rule and/or elites. Merited leaders gave way to hereditary leaders.
Your pizza story is irrelevant because in my worldview things like money and material wealth and items that are not collectively owned and shared would not exist; now there would be personal possessions to help in tasks like hunting or maybe ornamentation, but anything that is for the good of the group would be shared.
So perhaps what you’re kind of saying is that the group of 10 would have $50, and they’d discuss over how it should be spent.
Also, are you suggesting that humanity should return to hunting, or perhaps small agrarian groups who are short distances away from the food they grow?
In traditional hunter-gatherer societies, rather than relying on a moneyed economy or barter economy, they usually had what is called a gift economy. In this, your relationship with others is one of the most important things, and contributes to the cohesion of the group. It builds trust. One of the ways to do this is to always give each other gifts.
Civilization began when we stopped being hunter gatherers and started being sedentary with agriculture. Those structures you’re referring to were being built thousands of years after civilization began. One could argue it goes even deeper; when we stopped being immediate-return hunter gatherers and switched to delayed-return hunter gatherers, then the concept of elites began, which is the root of individualism, the cancer that led to the beginning of civilization.
Your pizza story is irrelevant because in my worldview things like money and material wealth and items that are not collectively owned and shared would not exist; now there would be personal possessions to help in tasks like hunting or maybe ornamentation, but anything that is for the good of the group would be shared. In traditional hunter-gatherer societies, rather than relying on a moneyed economy or barter economy, they usually had what is called a gift economy. In this, your relationship with others is one of the most important things, and contributes to the cohesion of the group. It builds trust. One of the ways to do this is to always give each other gifts.
IIUC, civilization started with cities, or at least towns; just as history began with writing.
I tend to think there was some overlap. e.g. there were/still are indigenous in the Amazon who while still hunting and gathering, also engage in agriculture, including slash-and-burn; meanwhile, many farmers also hunted; and let’s not forget herders. Wealth wasn’t only land one held, but also how much livestock one owned.
Elites probably resulted with larger groups, which might have been the result of technological advances, such as more farming, as well as specialization of labor. There was also gender-specific roles. Generally it was the men who hunted, while the women gathered, maybe butcher the carcasses, and made winter clothes, while rearing the children they bore.
Perhaps sometimes a band would raid other bands, then later simplify it to extortion. Consensus gave way to either majority rule and/or elites. Merited leaders gave way to hereditary leaders.
So perhaps what you’re kind of saying is that the group of 10 would have $50, and they’d discuss over how it should be spent.
Also, are you suggesting that humanity should return to hunting, or perhaps small agrarian groups who are short distances away from the food they grow?
How big would these societies be?